Any Questions? Comments? Complaints?
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One of my most Trusted MOGgers (Hi, poeby!) followed a link to an older post and marveled at the provocative nature of the subject matter and the thoughtful give-and-take in the thread. Then she asked, "Whatever happened to this kind of post at MOG?" So I floated a couple of theories.
Maybe the core group of MOGgers - the initial wave - covered so many bases in our first couple of years at MOG that we've run out of topics. Or maybe we MOGged about volatile issues and our favorite music with such enthusiasm that a wee bit of fatigue has set in. Or maybe the vociferous are now so outnumbered by lurkers or MMN bloggers that anything that would potentially stimulate fervent debate or opinion is lost in the shuffle.
I mean, I could wax ecstatic about the most recent Metric release, or discuss the differences between the original Broadway cast album and the feature film soundtrack of "West Side Story," or fume about pop-star excess, or rant about the morality of file-sharing. But instead, I'll just repeat poebegone's question: Whatever happened to incendiary, challenging, stimulating posts at MOG that spawned articulate debate?
And come to think of it, I'll run the stunning Deco Dawson film for Canadian art-rock band Metric's exquisite, head-spinning track "Help, I'm Alive" from the group's latest and highly recommended album Fantasies. This is, after all, MOG - home of the best music-blogging on the web.
Metric! Woo!
Comments (60)
That is the chicken...and this is the egg:
Been wondering the same thing for over a year or so...
I still have a lot in me. The weeks go by with at least one Mog post idea, that unfortunately never is made. My career change has left me with little time to mog like I used to. But on the other hand I have become a bit more of a "professional" blogger - or at least am learning to exploit the web for a hopeful future income.
I think Mog taught me a great deal of things about my writing and writing for the web. Mogging taught me how to be more succinct and to the point (if I wanted comments) and how to not hold on to things I'm working on (a bad habbit of creative types). I hope to return to some form of Mogging in the future, but for now, I lurk. Keep on posting Mogeezer's, I'll be readin' you!
Fasted: Well, yeah!
TTM: What would Yoda say? "Think not. Do you must!"
contra: I know. It can get tough to fit it all in. So lurk on, my brother. And MOG when you can.
People like me came along that didn't realize that MOG was ever that. I just thought this was the place to share and expose people to music that deserved to be heard.
If I'd had to be an articulate, stimulating writer or wax poetic, I'd be in trouble. I'll join in on some of those incendiary, challenging, stimulating posts, but mine will mostly be about the music I'm sharing.
Hope that doesn't mean I'm dragging the place down.
interesting Mike. i think i've become a bit of a "counter puncher", responding to posts rather than initiating them. whether it be hearing new music or reading dish like Lily Allen vs. Bob Lefsetz, as i make the rounds i still check out MOG regularly and enjoy it, sometimes even getting caught up in threads. part of it may have to do with being involved in music for so long and wanting to hear newer opinions. my feed page makes it more of a "hit and run" as well, but i'm here several times a day.
i'll hold off on posting about working with Mackenzie Phillips.
Hey Mike,
Thought I would throw my 2 cents in here because I have been around mog for about 3 years. Like you I am not sure why people stopped mogging they way they did a few years back. I can remember counting down the minutes until I was able to come down to my computer to begin my nightly ritual of checking out what was happening on MOG. Then a lot of my trusteds began to leave, I think for me that was a big part of it. I tried to stay active, yet it seemed the people who replaced them only wanted people to respond to their posts and the idea of posting on other peoples pages became a lost cause. I can remember posts that went on and on that started about music, but ended up talking about something like muppets. Now it seems you post, few if any respond to what you have written and that is it.
As for ideas of posts, they have not gone the way of the buffalo with me. I decided to take some time off and plan on coming back once the begining of school is over. Those first few weeks of school have me busy, and it has not helped that my classroom has been around 95 degrees the past two weeks. Not sure if that helped, but it felt good to repond to a post again!
There's a level of over saturation of all of the posts from mmn but mog allows you to filter all of that. In the beginning it was easier because there weren't so many people to filter through and even then it was a bit daunting. like ContraBW says this site really did help me even more with my writing skills and probably my communication skills. I'm far from saying everything about what I want to say. I've got tons to discuss. Lately I've felt Mog to be slightly exhausting. No fault of the site. Life has been tough over the last year. Has been for a lot of people. I like that random strangers still make random comments on my posts. I still haven't even touched on looking up all of the music I've learned from Mog. I try though. Last night I spent 2 hours looking for an avant garde french video that someone posted 2 years ago. I didn't find it on Mog because old posts aren't indexed on Google anymore but I knew enough from memory to find it. Mog is a good place to blog about music. You can't do that with last fm like you can here. It is a bit of a closed circuit but it's still very open. Oh I could go on and on. I keep thinking I will get into regular posting but then I get sidetracked. But this post is about all of us isn't it? I think it works best when we all pay attention to each other. I like that there are so many people here with such a wide range of tastes. i wouldn't have it any other way. I'm glad I could connect with people like you Mike and CBW and RWKDO and all the others. I think Mog works best when you participate with posting and commenting regularly. That seems to go the same for most websites and life.
New folks aren't made aware of the interactiveness possibilities. For the most part they aren't even posting. Folks have always come and gone, but the interactive side hasn't been promoted like it had been in the past. It is still here, but hard to notice on the home page.
I think it was hard to keep the pace we kept in days passed. I was spending multiple hours a day on the site..I haven't taken my biz elsewhere, but I can't spend the time I once did.
I also notice that when I do step up the posting I get wildy diminished returns.
In the end though, I think it is the lack of new,active posters that is the problem. The question is, how do we get new folks to start throwing their two cents in?
it would be nice to take over this place again, i feel the same way about multiply... maybe we all just got sick of each other being so close, an out dated houseguest... i don't know, people are strange... Mxxx
I think Sam kinda hit the nail on the head. MOG, like most other things, rewards you in direct proportion to the time you invest in it. Frankly, I haven't been able to invest time in much of anything. That's a shame too, as there's lots of great music out there that demands an audience, and there's a great audience right here.
Cody--that's what i meant about the feed page. it's a quick scan, pick the topic that grabs you for the time you've got at the moment, interact and get back to work.
i'll tell you what's interesting. i've got less time to spend here because i'm spending more time multitasking due to the state of the music industry when it comes to earning a living. i guess saying that file-sharing contributes to less posting would be pushing it a bit though, huh? i do see a bunch of people having less time due to work issues though. i don't think this thread will make it to the Muppets, but we're still here and maybe there'll be a surge towards the type we love without a government bailout.
MusicRX: All right. Enough with the self-deprecation. Don't hide your light under a bushel, man. Anyone who follows your MOG page knows that they'll get a worthy earful. The main point has always been about parading our musical tastes, and sharing the news about the classic and the new with like-minded individuals. It's just that, in the past, there have been wonderful and idiosyncratic insights that set the MOG-o-sphere afire - and they are always welcome.
Robin: Hit and run? I'd call those happy accidents. And now we hear that you worked with Mackenzie. Hope you've kept TMZ at bay.
Rawk: I know this is a busy time for you, so I'm grateful for the extended drive-by. For me, it's almost not a thread without some of the regulars checking in. Again, thanks from me, Kermit, Miss Piggy, and Fozzie.
fistie: D'accord. You guys and gals who take the time to champion great sounds and exchange ideas with me are MOG at its finest. Still the best music site in cyberspace. I guess it's largely about making time to treat it right. (Viva the French avant garde!)
C.B.: Time is so precious, but hearing about previously unheard goodies is worth it to me. And that's an interesting question. Could more heat be generated by dropping by their posts (the interesting ones) and initiating a thread? One would hope that would lead to some tit-for-tat.
YOUNGMOSSTONGUE: Carpe MOGum! Often a break can be refreshing, although I don't think that they should be mandatory. ;-)
Dale: Well said, comrade-in-tunes. It's very satisfying to see you and other valued MOG regulars chime in here. There's no better feedback than that which comes from people whose opinions you respect.
And Robin, about the Muppets: Kermit, Miss Piggy and Fozzie tell me that they loved your most recent work with Celia. As a matter of fact, Piggy's looking for a producer to help her with her upcoming album of love songs Makin' Bacon. Interested?
I think Cody's answer is THE answer. People's lives change, so attrition is natural. But a newbie would be hard-pressed to notice that the site still has a social, interactive side. Thus, regular Moggers are an ever-shrinking population.
Frankly, MOG has added several big nails to the coffin by shutting off uploads for "a couple of weeks" (now a month and counting..and no updates coming). I still comment but am not willing to invest the time to learn new upload programs while waiting for MOG to finish it's latest up(?)grade, so I don't post any more.
I dunno - i guess i said a lot of what i had to say and (quite frankly) i've sunk so far into depression that most days i never think of anything new to say that i think would be interesting.
And i don't listen to the radio or hear much new music thses days, either.
OTOH, i've just heard that the UK Government is thinking about banning alcohol advertising, including possibly sponsorship of events.
If that happens, there go a number of music-related events in the UK - i immediately thought of Fairport's Cropredy Festival, for instance.
Maybe i'll work up enough indignation to do a post about that.
But likely not.
"Nothing matters, and it wouldn't make a difference if it did."
Well, i notice that Cody B & the disgusting deadman still post controversial items sumtimes. deadman starts arguments with his ugly rants
Hey Mike, I enjoy wonderful and idiosyncratic insights. What I'm saying is, that I'm not sure I have the capacity to engage in that way in my posts, but I still do want to make MOG a great place to discover new and worthwhile music.
I think that a lot of the newbies would be more like me as well, coming into the site and posting for the first time. We don't want to ignore their posts or not comment on them simply because they didn't offer deep insight, pose a question or promote controversy in their post.
We need to embrace even the one line "I really like this band" type posts and offer a comment in agreement, if we do too. That's the only way we have a chance at keeping them and developing them into great posters and interacters like me (Ha Ha).
That's all really meant to say. IMHO, newbies like that need that kind of encouragement. Much love!
Work took over. When I was just hustling for the money I seemed to have time. Now I've got the money I'm hustling to make the business last. When I finally stop around 10pm I just want to watch some of the films and tv shows I recorded some weeks ago on my PVR.
Also the entry of MMN definitely had an effect. Good for MOG's business, not so good for our little club.
Hmm, time to write another post.
Absolutely love the feeds, but you can't find anybody new that way...new posters need to be encouraged (by MOG ambassadors,MOGers,cash prizes:))...like button needs to come back (top 10 should be "above the fold" on the home page)...editors should choose a top 10 of the last 24 hours from MOG posts...top comment posts should make the home page under the banner of "join the conversation"...the mogger of the week profiles should come back....Rx had some cool ideas about IM chat room buddy window stuff that'll let you know who's on line. Maybe a feature that allows you to see who viewed your post would be cool too...I've heard the trusted mog sections are getting fixed, so that's good too.
In general, I think the interactive Mogger based content should be given emphasis..If hundreds (thousands) join the site and just one or two additional folks join in the fray, it will mushroom from there.
On the other hand, as many have said, the days of yore can't return. A person simply can't look at the entire MOS and take it all in, because the site is too big to take it all in. The intimacy of those days is gone, with many of the folks moving on to their own blogs,but that doesn't mean the interactive side of MOG has to go downhill...it just needs new voices. Those voices may leave at some point or reduce their posting/commenting frequency..but hopefully they will be replaced. To keep the cycle going, the interactive side must be played up.
Some things never change..A post about MOG will always get some attention. Add muppets and it feels like 2006 all opver again.
The disgusting deadman?
Great post and responses. Mog is evolving and some of the new features like the feed page are helpful. The MMN content is good, but less interactive than when you folks post new, old, obscure, or toxic songs.
I will be back more when the red dot returns -- I like easy.
P.S. Metric is hot! One of the best albums all the way through of 2009. You can put it on and leave it on.
What kept Mog alive for me was the community. Period.
When the MMN's joined I asked DH for a Mogger's Only filter on the main page. The e-mails back and forth were hard...He blamed me for being exclusionary and I blamed him for taking away the community like feel. I never disclosed what we discussed as it was heated and inflamitory on both sides, but I could tell that the direction that Mog was going was more of an informational/content driven site, then the community site that we once played on.
In all fairness to DH, the information/content about music is higher...just look at the home page and you feel like you can learn up to the minute information about the music world, but BALANCE...the community is gone. It was sacrificed for the sake of content. How I wish it was different.
So yes, now I lurk, in hopes of it becoming what it was again...and I know my lurking doesn't help make that a reality. Shame on me. But I, like Kevin, used to come home, on pins and needles, ready to open the MOS to see what's been said/posted. And I don't now. So ultimately...what's all that great content for?
Thank you Mike.
Why do we always come here? I guess we'll never know! It's like a kind of torture to have to watch the show!
On another note I would like to see the Muppet theme performed by RNRPimp's Mogettes. The Mogette Show would be an excellent crossover and unifier.
well, Mike. you got me off (uh......on) my butt and back to typing a post as opposed to a comment. let's see if this "trend" takes off. you gave it a shot!
I haven't read all the replies to this one yet. (so many words, so little time) but I will say that I am currently in the process of withdrawal, and fighting it. Music wise, I'm not a critical listener and therefore not able to provide consistent intelligent insight. I like certain music and I like to share it. Period.
From a writing perspective, I've always liked to share my views on any topic, not just music. So as I said a few posts back, I tend to use MOG as my blog, and thankfully there are enough MOGgers who like to read as well as listen to music so that I get a sense of satisfaction from it all.
But about 6 months ago, many of my Trusted's just stopped logging on. Or at least stopped commenting. Right now I would say that there is a core group of about 10 or less who I interact with regularly. I've looked at my old posts to see if I said or implied something that would have turned these absentees off in some way, but haven't found an obvious reason.
To be honest, the energy it takes to focus constantly on one topic in my life, music, is starting to seem more than what I want to give. Music is an integral part of who I am, but it's not all that I am. Writing is something I enjoy, but it too seems to come in waves that get interrupted by dead zones that can last for months.
But perhaps the pressure I'm perceiving to be here every day or lose whatever it is I see as being lost, is false, or is of my own making and really doesn't exist. Perhaps I should just realize that MOG, like much in life, can come, be enjoyed, and then pass. And that should be ok. Except people are involved. People who I've come to like a lot as personalities are increasingly exposed.
I've come to realize that my music taste is mine alone, regardless of how many others enjoy what I post. And in that, I must be content, for we are a crowd of similarly affected afficionados, enjoying the deep impact of our chosen tastes, and happy to share as well as enjoy when that experience is passed on to others.
Successful bloggers are ones who see the irony and adventure in the every day events and can turn it into prose that many enjoy. To do it for that, however, can be a futile endeavour, especially if the talent to portray those ideas is less than personally assessed.
And that brings me to my final QED, which is that while I'm in this funk, I will simply post songs, knowing that a time will come when words to accompany them will spill forth and perhaps gain some recognition and provide some satisfaction in the form that MOG has become known for.
One other thing..while I often vehemently disagree with DM² (Jeff)..I still think he's good people...ie. not disgusting.
I thought the post and numerous responses were interesting. I do comment and still think I have something to share with others, although I do not feel inclined to add sound to my comments. There is a community here, and I have learned and benefitted from getting to know Robin, DMDM, Mike, Baudolino, Musikfriend and oooh, so many others. Three cheers for degenerate, slightly obsessive music heads!
As a relatively new Mogger I perceive that I've evolved a bit from my initial Mog contact. At first I was intent on listening to posts' music and presenting some music without much comment. Like Rx suggest, I don't often have indepth insight available beyond something like, "Shweettt!" I must confess that my impressions of the seeming expectation for those indepth comments do dampend my enthusiasm at times. Yet it doesn't bother me much that I don't get many comments. As I develop more "Trusteds", more generally captivating topics, more time to write, etc. that will come. I'm generally a patient person. In the end though, the number of comments a posts receives really shouldn't drive the topic. Ideally the chosen topic (current or future) should have its own life regardless of Moggers' response. That it's more fun when there's more interaction does counter the ideal though.
Oh, Metric = "Shweettt!"
Ditto what Cody says about DMDM...I have had several occasions to privately communicate with Jeff about differences we've had, and he's actually quite sweet...but I'm not supposed to tell anyone that.
Sorry I missed that comment on the first pass...but that needed to be said.
So glad you posted Metric. So far it is the one album I constantly listen to. i prefer now not to compare the current version of MOG to the old one. As a few people I have done the I'm leaving and return a few weeks later bit. Yes I loved the MOG before and couldn't wait to log on. Things change just like any long term relationship. Most people here have breathed music their whole life including myself. I love that so many people have responded. I appreciate everyone here nothing like having so many opinions thrown about. The community is kinda still here but it seems you must make more of an effort. I try to add one new trusted every month it keeps my feed active which I like better than the old email way. Nice post Mike... sometimes some of us just need to be nudged once in a while
Cody and I have actually been chatting privately about ways to encourage community and pump up involvement. We have lots of ideas that we want to pass by DH and I think he may be receptive to a number of them.
We are kind of waiting to see what he already has programed into the new version of MOG, expected to launch within the next few weeks. Then we will present ideas to enhance what's already there. Who knows, we may get some of the enhancements we suggest.
But bottom line is, we need ways to catch the 1st posts of newbies that arrive, recognize them, welcome them and comment on their posts, regardless of how much they say or whether anything is insightful. Chances are, they won't be masterpieces to begin with. And that should not deter us from welcoming them with a comment and encouragement. We definitely need the type of posts you are wondering about, Mike, but IMHO, we need the other type too.
The fact that they even took the step to post, rather than lurk and read/listen, says to me that they need to be nurtured further. I have suggested a "first post" type feed or module on the home page. Kind of like other sites do by noting newest members. Maybe it will happen. It would probably almost double as a "least popular" feed to go along with the "most popular" filter.
If I hadn't been warmly welcomed by dermahrk when I sent my first little post into the M-O-S, I probably would have thought, what's the point of posting, if no one cares?? I think he was the first one to welcome me and suggest by his enthusiasm, that perhaps MOG could use someone like me with my particular tastes in music. He was glad I was here and that caused me to want to stay. Thanks Mark!
Do you all get it? We need to treat the newbies in a similar fashion in order to retain them and develop them into great posters and interacters. And not just the newbies, but encourage each other as well.
It's up to us. If we are unwilling to post or even comment on what we read or listen to, we are not helping the community or helping find and polish the diamonds in the rough.
It's too easy to hide on this site. That's why I hope there will be some sort of IM capability in the new MOG, so we can see who's active, interact, find out what posts we are reading or enjoying, pass on tips about new arrivals or post you know would be up someone's alley- and so forth- in real time!!
The ability to IM Jeff and say, "hey I just read a post by RGM that I think would really stir your senses", would be so cool. Jeff would get right on it and deliver very insightful comments and reactions we could all tack on to and help promote healthy debate.
I'll get off my rant now and you can all let the slings and arrows fly my direction. Peace and Love MOGgers!
It used to be de rigeur to welcome new posters..for a long while MOG did it internally and then folks like DM, and Mark, and many others actually, started with the welcome wagon..but yeah, since the feed is so effective for keeping up with folks you know, welcoming new folks has slowed a bit..
I know that "you get what you put in", but that still doesn't change the fact that the main focus of the site (according to the home page) is blog aggregation and news.
I don't want any features added to make it "better" for the old timers (except general smooth running of current features)...I want to see new folks encouraged to add to the mix....for me that means more focus on mogger activity on the home page. Anything else is gravy.
it's interesting to see you guys speaking about the home page. use me as an example if you'd like, because this is meant to be supportive, but i can't remember going there since the feed came about. when i launch my browser, i've got several tabs that open automatically and MOG is at my feed. the way i find newbies is usually through comments or latest post links.
i will admit that i'm also still rooting for an iPhone app or MOG option that's fast and easy for phone browsers. i'd love to have a text version that's as quick and easy as iGoogle, whether as an app or Safari.
Yes Robin! A mobile app is most needed. I was just thinking of that tonight.
Cody I think you get what you put into it insofar as you post a lot and you comment on multiple posts. If you do that you have a winning system. I've tested that in the past and it works. Doesn't mean that I discount people's posts but people are more apt to comment when you have a dialog with them. Of course you have to post something someone cares about. I used to get torqued out if someone didn't comment on something that in my mind was a supremely awesome post. There's also a lot of variables of why someone wouldn't comment which includes being busy with normal life. I'm pretty cool with the mog it up function.
Mike I had a thought late tonight that I enjoy Mog because it allows me to combine words with sounds. Just like how comic books are words with pictures. There's a certain dynamic that is created on this site that I don't think other sites have. Someone needs to write the Understanding Mog book.
Wow! What an outpouring of opinions, observations and ideas! Every last one of you has my respect, and I am interested and cheered whenever I find that any of you have posted or commented. (And that absolutely includes the vehement deadmandeadman whose political beliefs - and favorite sports teams - can be diametrically opposed to mine, but whose impeccable taste in music often intersects with my own.) Good on y'all!
dermahrk: As I said to Cody, increased interaction with the new MOGgers might be a reasonable approach. Not to rip off an advertising motto, but we should just do it. And I too miss the mp3 uploads and their workability in older posts. But, as I understand it, that's just a temporary thing. I've been getting around the sitch by finding the music I want to stream in YouTube videos that I then embed on my MOG page.
fairportfan: Cheer up, friend! And raise your voice. I say that it feels good to vent your spleen in the service of a just cause - and fine music.
genderblender: That's Web 2.0 for ya, where all opinions - whether I agree with them or not - are created equal.
MusicRX: There's no question that you do your part, and I agree that embracing the newbies is a smart move. I may be very curious and eventually gratified to know about that band they really like - as long as they let me in on it. And no slings and arrows from me. The fruits of your brainstorming sessions with Cody should definitely be brought to Hyman and company.
Jonh: All valid excuses. Now hit that keyboard! (BTW, thanks for the "Ode.")
Cody: As I implied in the previous response to MusicRX, you are an idea machine. Indeed, the welocme-wagon and a little nurturing would go a long way to reinforcing community. I hope that some of the powers-that-be take notice here. Great suggestions - even if they'd have to be enacted in a new MOG order wherein the focus has changed.
deadmandeadman: Maybe it's a reference to the creepy image of a decaying skeleton...
funoka: Yeah! I love MOG old and new, but, seriously...The red dot rules! And we are so on the same page about Metric.
annie: It does seem like a trade-off, even if I agree that the news/info content is becoming the best on the web. But this thread is evidence that some of the rarified but egalitarian proto-MOG community is still around. And, for the record, I'm honored to learn that you might occasionally lurk around my posts. You're always welcome, sister.
fistula spume: I am grinning ear-to-ear! I guess it's time to get things started. And how does that New Radicals lyric go? Right. "You get what you give." (Wait a minute. Did you just invoke Scott McCloud? Yeah. You right. Words and sounds. A winning combo.)
Robin: I could do no less. Write on, dude! Regarding your other comments, I'm one of those who uses e-mail alerts and the home page to plot my MOG course every day - rather than the feed. As for your tech wish-list, I'm just a wordsmith who knows how to turn a device on and off. Your new-fangled apps just confuse and frighten me. (heh)
capndad: Again, I believe that the fatigue factor could have something to do with less traffic in the threads. Like fistie and a few others, you have a certain expertise and passion about specific genres that can enrich those who have access to your MOG page. It would be a shame to lose all of that, particularly when the mp3 streams return. But the time and energy factors are real, so I'm happy with whatever any of us bring to the table, whenever we can.
BerkeleyBob: Ditto, and back atcha! We can sing and play together or alone, but I do love harmony - and that requires more than one voice.
Dabeef: Despite triggering all of this discourse by quoting poe, I don't think depth in commentary is mandatory. Enthusiam for worthy music should be the only prerequisite here, and if that leads to an elegant debate, witty banter, or a chorus of approval (which it has in the past), interested parties can benefit from it. (And "Shweettt," indeed!)
cpetersonart3: Aye-aye again on Metric. As for your take on the state of the MOG and your place in it, nicely put.
The first year on here was a lot of fun. I met a dozen plus Moggers and am still friends with half a dozen.
David was never going to make money out of 8 or 9 groups of hardcore Moggers and so it has moved on plus we all got slightly bored and move onto other sites.
Such is the way of the world...
Don't be so sentimental Neill...
Sam (Spume) Said:
Cody I think you get what you put into it insofar as you post a lot and you comment on multiple posts. If you do that you have a winning system. I've tested that in the past and it works. Doesn't mean that I discount people's posts but people are more apt to comment when you have a dialog with them. Of course you have to post something someone cares about. I used to get torqued out if someone didn't comment on something that in my mind was a supremely awesome post. There's also a lot of variables of why someone wouldn't comment which includes being busy with normal life. I'm pretty cool with the mog it up function.
And I totally agree that commenting is the way to get comments, get trusteds, and it's the way to make the world go 'round.
I don't understand the MOG it up function..where does it come into play? Where do I see a list of the most mogged up posts?
Robin Said:
i've got several tabs that open automatically and MOG is at my feed. the way i find newbies is usually through comments or latest post links.
I have defintely found folks in comments of other folks. My comments here are less about retention of vets and my needs (I have many), but more about getting new folks to join in the conversation.
For me, I am close to letting go of the old style of complete MOG O Sphere coverage that I used to live by. I look at my feed first..but I do check the home page for the blog news too.
I guess the way the MMN did not integrate into the MOG world created a problem for me..cause it is all about sending you to the MMN'ers blog..they added news to MOG, and heft, and eyeballs, and their page views..but there was no give and take (for the most part).
I get it..I understand the need for the news, I understand the cliquing up, I get the feed. Like Sam said, I think the sounds and words thing has a dynamic that can continue.
Part of it will be through us doing what we do and part of it will be from a steady infusion of new people who are encouraged to contribute.
I agree with a lot of what you say Cody. For me the MOG O Sphere is broken.I look at my feed first and then I do the most recent posts almost daily for moggers only and there aren't many and that is where I find new people. However, what I have found is that very few of these newbies come back to post again. For me the MMN bloggers are mostly a one way street to them only. If there wasn't a number of views on my post page I probably would have given up by now because the comments seem fewer with a few exceptions. I don't get the mog it up button at all.If I was a new person and tried to post a song I would be very frustrated with the current way of posting songs.I am still committed here but MOG is not on the top of my list like it once was.
I hear people saying a lot of what I feel. I value highly the comments I get from you all. I often, maybe always, post with you all in mind. I want to share something and it is a good thing to hear that you listened. Sometimes a trusted comments even when he doesn't have something profound or long winded to say. I think that's great because I at least know you listened and appreciated my post. Just the number of views is a mystery, though at least a llittle affirming. I do wish for more of us. [I've been her just under a year and you have made me feel I can say "us"] I always like to visit the homepage of someone I haven't heard from before and make them feel welcome if they are new. That's the way you all treated me.
Also, I almost never view or read any of the content. I'm more interested in what you all are listening to.
Hey Cody your right. There needs to be a "most popular" that sorts by the mog it ups. There's a most read and a most discussed and and recently popular but nothing in regards to the useless function. Still I like it. It lets me know people are paying attention.
Please Cody B, I woke up this morning and my pillow was soaking wet......hang on, I think that may have been the fat girl I came home with last night.
("Internet dating: the odds are good but the goods are odd.")
mike--
i may be old school in my own way since i'm not supportive of file-sharing, but saying:
"Your new-fangled apps just confuse and frighten me. (heh)"
isn't supporting your cause in this case. you won't need to use them so don't worry. make 'em for others!
besides the apps, i LOVE my iGoogle homepage. i've got text only lists of headlines that i want to scan......multiply the MOG feed by 1000. it comes in easy on my phone as well and you can click on the headline you want and go to the actual site. i've got the NY Times, BBC, Huffington Report, ESPN and other real news (like THE ONION) sitting on my desktop at all times along with Google maps featuring LA traffic reports.
when it comes to music? i've got things like NME, Pitchfork, SXSW and Rolling Stone......both a "daily" version and a "features" version. i would LOVE to be able to add MOG to my home page and i know there are many others using this page as well. if you consider MOG to be a great news source would you mind seeing the headlines just pop up on your home page? if Rolling Stone (and every other news source) has various versions, maybe you'd have the "MOG HEADLINES" and "MOG POSTS" come up on your page. you can pick the number of items that get shown and it's all links.
i don't work for those guys, but it's a good way to make it an easy link to MOG for many people that use Google and don't use apps.
Hey Robin, every MOG filter combo has an RSS and most have a Google and Yahoo add button for a feed that you can add to your iGoogle home page or My Yahoo page. At least, I think it will work, as long as you have a way of manually adding a feed, if there's not a Google button.
I have RSS feeds for Mogger only posts, for mmn posts, for all posts with audio, for all posts with embeded media, for rock posts, blues posts, country posts, as well as a number of my trusted Moggers posts from their profile page RRS . You can really keep up with everything, without even logging into MOG. Check it out.
Neill: Sic transit MOG? Whatever, dude. I do agree that commercial considerations must rule at this juncture, but I'd never want to diminish the human element. I too have made friends here - people that I value - and there's no reason for that to be back-burnered if I can help it.
Cody: How did that Sam & Dave classic go? "MOG it up - I'll take it!" As stated above, I react to e-mail alerts from my Trusteds and peruse the home page for info, commenting where it matters to me - although much more on MOGgers' threads than in the MMN zone. That lack of integration between regular MOGgers and the MMN is certainly an issue worth addressing, although one might have to shrug and just say "It is what it is."
cpetersonart3: Good point. A would-be MOGger encountering MOG as it is currently set up - without a built-in mp3-posting app and player - isn't getting the full effect and might be less likely to stick around. I'm waiting for the webmasters to fix this, and I'm sure it would help encourage more proactive newbies.
Spike 1: To my mind, you are a model MOGger - the kind of person that this site originally cultivated and desired as a participant. And I think we'd all agree that there's room for more.
fistula spume: Hmmm. MOG it up, MOG it down - as long as you MOG it.
Robin: Say what? I was just kidding around - and misquoting Phil Hartman's old SNL character Unfrozen Caveman Lawyer. I live in 2009, just like the rest of you. But rather than do all this stuff on the phone, I do it on my laptop since I like bigger page reads and images.
MusicRX: Thanks for the prescription, doc! Those be valuable reminders.
LOLOLOLOL Neill..Butt Naked Booty Bless- Poor Righteous Teachers
There is a functionality issue methinks..If I comment on an MMN post here..they will not see the comment, if I am not mistaken.
I know this is true...my attitude has to change. There can be many tweaks or no tweaks. I either need to start my own blog and live and build in that network, or figure out a way to stay a Mogger and deal with the fact that only a handful of the folks here will ever comment.
I gotta stop worrying and love The MOG.
RX--thanks. i'll definitely give it a shot. but user-friendly is keyand not many newbies are gonna read the MOG manual. you're great for your posts on how to deal without the red button and it's good for peeps that already love it here. but if the goal's to attract and keep Moggers, i think it's asking a lot for people to go "hmmm.....i wonder how i can post songs here", or "maybe i can get RSS feeds on my homepage". there are masses on Facebook, so many people do that, but just as many don't bother.
Mike--no worries. in 2010, when you're back on 2 legs, you'll be Mogging on your phone. i'm kidding around too, man.
RX--tried adding Mog to iGoogle, Google Reader and as an RSS feed to another reader on my homepage. the error message said "parsing error", which when i went to a translation page, said that Google isn't supporting pages that require user names and passwords. doesn't really make sense since i did this from the Mog link on the filter pages. they must be up there for a reason and you said it works for you. maybe it's a Mac thing? i use Safari and Firefox.
we can take this off of this thread, but the bottom line applies. i'm kind of a tech and if Mog's reaching out, it's gotta be "user friendly".
Robin, I have it working on My Yahoo. I'll try it on Google and if I get it going, I'll MOGmail you how to do it.
All of your comments have covered what I haven't been able to articulate so I do appreciate everyone for taking the time to state your theories, comments and complaints here on Mike's post. It has been quiet otherwise. Waiting to see what will happen with the new version.
Haven't posted since the shutdown of uploading audio feature but have left comments on the posts of others. Knowing that most of the moggers are also not uploading has kept me from logging on a daily basis to hear music.
litttemp3.com
easy as pie.
very sorry about delays here. and we clearly don't make it clear to new users that contributing is easy with links to post right on home page. we're going to take a lot of the feedback we're hearing and incorporate. we've been very busy. y'all see why soon.
I like you deadmandeadman!
not surprised tho. i can see how some would perceive him as offensive/confrontational the 1st few times one encounters him. ya just gotta look beyond the cover to what's going on inside the book. DMDM challenges everything. It's a very un-lazy way to think, try it sometime!
(Now Fedge was disgusting. consider yourself lucky if you never met him here, i don't think ANYONE appreciated that guy's rants!)
Some really interesting points are raised here. Everybody has a different reason why they don't Mog as much as those happy days of the Mogosphere (which was the original reason why I signed up in October 2006).
My Mog account was inadvertently deleted when all the changes occured earlier in the year. To be honest, most of my trusted moggers had disappeared anyway (except you Mike).
Lets face facts. Mogging (the community) doesn't make money. Just look at the front page.
There's NO encouragement to sign up as a mogger.
Mr Hyman and his shareholders get their return from advertisers.
Advertisers won't invest if there isn't enough hits.
To get the hits, Mr Hyman and his team need content,lots of it, particularly latest news. That's why the MNN is advertised on the front page.
Mr Hyman won't get the necessary hits from a Mogger posting about a Columbian folk album that sold about 500 copies and was deleted in 1967.
It's all about MONEY people.
"rock & roller, cola wars, I can't take it anymore"
By the way, what happened to Michael Goldberg?
David - It's http://www.littlemp3.com/. That's fun and good to see. I like Divshare a lot. Let's see how this looks.
Molli - There was no mistaking Fedge's evilness. I'm surprised there haven't been tons more like him. He's not missed but I bet he's pleased he is still invoked in conversation.
Hacksceptic - Goldberg is still here, just check his mog page. like everyone else, he doesn't post as often these days, but he still pops in semi-regularly.
MusicRX - an idea for reaching out to n00bs/welcoming them - i haven't tried this yet, but it seems like you could use the mog only filter to look at the "Most Read" posts "This Week" or whatever time frame you want to use. It shows the posts that fit that criteria in order of most read to least read, so if you scroll to the bottom and jump to the very last page you'd find those newbie posts on the last few pages. (And once you're in the right place, just bookmark the page so you can get back to it in a single click.)
Robin - I subscribe to all my fave MOG feeds in Google Reader and i have my Reader on my iGoogle page so it's a lot like having a MOG app filled with my fave feeds. this has been working great for me for a few months now. I'm not on a mac but this should work on any computer since it's a google thang. HOWEVER, i think rss feeds for individual moggers might be avail only to logged in members. when i tried adding those feeds to Reader, i got the same error as you (& if you sign out, you can no longer access those rss links on mogger's profile pages). but i've had no probs with all other feeds (like using the filters or news/editor's picks/feeds for specific bands etc.
Fistula - sounds like you're talkin 'bout Word Sound Power! Rastafarians believe that all sounds have power and we can wield that power depending on how we say & use words. as such, the effect words have when spoken out loud can be changed by mutating their sounds. this led to words like "downpressor" instead of "oppressor" (which sounds like saying "up-pressor" i.e. one who uplifts), "overstanding" something instead of standing under the knowledge and calling "politricks" exactly what they are... we could prolly turn this into some kind of MOG music game...?! =)
well, now, 59 comments and counting just about resolves it, Mike. yeah, it may have just been summer, after all. ;d
i have gone over one theory after another as to what has happened to Mogging over time but, at the end of the day, the one answer i keep coming back to is that change begins within every one of us. so my own resolution, i suppose, is to simply keep Mogging undauntedly.
hey! me likey new Metric. very much looking forward to getting it now. aaahh, Mogging is alive and well.
Cody B: Cody Strangelove? Another interesting point, re: the MMN comment sitch. But contrabandwidth apparently sees the comments on his MMN blog, because he has responded to them. Curious.
Robin: Hey! Didn't you get the word? I am back on two legs (albeit sometimes with a snazzy pimp cane). And yes, user-friendly is a key to continued/enhanced community-building.
MusicRX: All right! Functionality to the people!
The Time Machine: Still, it's encouraging to have you in the mix to any extent. And the new-and-improved MOG is almost upon us.
david hyman: Excellent!
Hacksceptic: Brutal, but fair appraisal. There are certain economic realities that must be accepted. With that in mind, I'm gonna be patient and continue to take advantage of what MOG offers. Although the community may have changed in some ways, this thread shows that it's far from gone.
fistula spume: Who doesn't prefer fudge to Fedge?
mollifire: Protean responses, sister! Chock fulla good ideas.
poebegone: Uh-oh. Could we have awakened a sleeping giant? Nah. It was just a long, slow blink. Meanwhile, nice to know that yer diggin' the Metrickery. (And there's my leetle stab at Word Sound Power for today.)