WE DO THE MASHED POTATO AND THE FUNKY CHICKEN
Brutha Los
Brutha Los of Company of Prophets
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Asswhippin'

Posted about 1 year ago
So the cops got away with shooting a brother at his bachelor's party in Jersey. 50 bullets. Hillary and McCain are trying to pull a "Willie Horton" on Obama. This song came out over 12 years ago, about the state of Black Folk in this country for the first 200 years, and it's still relevant. Things just don't change in the U.S.
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Comments (30)

  1. TroyPowers
    TroyPowers says Man, I think this is the first Sean Bell post on Mog. I considered posting one myself, but I just can't. It's a strange feeling, man. I don't even feel the outrage that I know I should. I don't know if I'm just numb to it. I don't know if I'm starting to accept it as the way things are. I mean, after the verdict came down, there was no discussion of it in my house. None. I mean, I'm upset about it, but I don't have that "Kill Whitey" feeling in my heart that I believe I should. I don't have that, "Get out there and burn this bitch to the ground," feeling. And that bothers me.
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  2. Brutha Los
    Brutha Los says i know right. no riots, no protests, no nothing. not from me either. i wish i had some answers, but right now it's just my lonely-ass observations.
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  3. Cody B
    Cody B says Not that it matters that much, but the shooting was in Queens,NY,NY. The DA took the case for political reasons and some say the office phoned in the prosecution. That said, I think part of the lack of outrage stems from the fact that both the victim and the shooters were people of color, so there wasn't a direct racial angle like Amadou Diallo or Rodney King. I was not shocked by the verdict at all, partly because if the police weren't guilty in Diallo or King they never would be here, because, though excessive force was used, I think the cops had the right to shoot here. The question to me is why were they there in the first place? And how safe can it be for anybody (cops/patrons) when undercover cops are outside a strip bar at closing time. What info were they gathering there? Black and Latino undercover cops get put into some real tough spots and I believe this was one. Why didn't they just have a patrol car out there? That would've been a lot safer, if safety was the actual concern. Not that it is helpful in any way, but the family is going to be able to win a huge award in the civil case. All that does,though, is point to the sickness in the system. Very frustrating, but I don't think that convicting those cops would have solved anything. Until people higher up the command chain can be held responsible for this, it will continue. They are the folks that put those cops in an untenable position.
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  4. TroyPowers
    TroyPowers says Though, I don't know all the details about what happened that night, I don't believe the cops had the right to shoot. I don't think it was justified. "I thought I saw a gun" is not justification. You're a cop. You're a professional. You should KNOW whether or not you saw a gun. If you're Joe Blow, and you were scared and you thought you saw a gun...maybe. But, come on? You saw niggers (who were probably drunk). And just having the thought in your head that these drunk niggers and this shady ass strip club (by the way, the cops were reportedly there to investigate reports of prostitution), you just figured, "Damnit, they've probably got guns in this neighborhood. I thought I heard one say go get my gun. I thought I saw one reach for his waistline." Sorry, dude, that doesn't cut it. And I'm damned sure the same thing wouldn't happen to 3 drunk frat boys at a strip club in Manhattan...even if they were screaming at the top of their lungs, "I'm gonna get my gun and shoot up all of you!" Believe me, I understand that being a cop is a tough job, and you have to make some hard decisions. Decisions that your life will depend on. But, the fact that these men were black in a black neighborhood does not justify making the WRONG decision. And it matters not a lick to me that the cops were not white. They were cops. The training they go through, the environment they're in, it's damn near brain-washing. They're trained that niggas in the ghetto are the bad guys.
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  5. Cody B
    Cody B says Agreed, it doesn't matter if the cop is black or white, but if you are a cop coming up to a car and the driver turns on the engine and guns it right toward you, what do you do? Let me ask this, if the cops were convicted, would it solve this: "The training they go through, the environment they're in, it's damn near brain-washing. They're trained that niggas in the ghetto are the bad guys."
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  6. Jonh Ingham
    Jonh Ingham says Reading this has made me reflect on what goes on in the UK. We never read or see/hear about cop violence in the asian/carib/african/arab parts of the cities and I wonder how much it goes on. Cops are cops - it's a mentality - and the country of action doesn't change that. What we do get in the media is kids killing kids. 18 teenagers murdered in London so far this year. And yesterday a bunch of teen boys just got life sentences for beating a teen girl to death simply because she was a Goth.
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  7. TroyPowers
    TroyPowers says Cody, no, it probably wouldn't have solved the problem, but it would have sent a message that it won't be tolerated any more. Maybe after a couple cops actually get convicted for letting their biases cost someone their life, somebody will decide to make some changes. But, when they're acquitted, it's just business as usual. If anything, it makes cops bolder and sends the message that it's okay to shoot a few niggers 50 times because you were scared. JI: Yeah, I think I would be more worried if I lived in a place where I didn't hear about these things. Wasn't it just 10 years ago or less that cops in England didn't even carry guns, or was that a misconception?
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  8. Jonh Ingham
    Jonh Ingham says Regular cops still don't carry guns, but that's changing. Gun crime is climbing really fast and there are plans to equip all cops. At the moment they need to be part of a special unit, usually something to do with terrorism or riot control. (Or moving money from banks etc.) When you see guns on the law they tend to be automatic rifles and machine guns and at airports, train stations and so on.
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  9. Cody B
    Cody B says What I'm sayin' is that they should go after the people who set these things up to happen. If a cop is poorly trained and kills somebody, look at the system who trained the cop and penalize there. I'm not trying to defend the police! But just like convictions for Abu Gahrib folks didn't mean anything, a conviction here would be small consolation. If the culture is to change higher ups need to be held responsible for the system they run and perpetuate.
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  10. runobodyii
    runobodyii says Don't think yous in the UK (or anywhere else in the civilized world for that matter) have the kinds of guns out there on the streets that we do in the U.S. which underwrites the cops use of excessive force. I almost posted an email from the A.N.S.W.E.R. coaltion written in response to the verdict and calling folks out for a protest, but I decided that 1) no one on here would give f***k and 2) not many folks read my posts anyway. So I think the people who are outraged about everything that goes on in this country and the world were outraged, while the apathetic went on being apathetic. Contrary to appearances, I am not much interested in politics, but I am interested in justice, and in the interest of justice, regardless of whether or not it would change systemic racism / police violence, those cops should have been convicted. One expert bullet would suffice to disable a shooter, what the deuce were fifty for?
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  11. TroyPowers
    TroyPowers says I understand that higher-ups need to be charged, but you have to start somewhere. SOMETHING is better than nothing. Let's look at it like this. When I lived in Germany, I went to a club one Sunday night with a friend of mine. When we got to the door, the security guy looked at us and said, "Sorry, but we don't allow black people here on Sunday night." The guy said it so boldly and with such a lack of any malice that I thought, "Wow, it must be okay to say and do shit like that in Germany." So, we left. The next day, still completely baffled by the entire situation, I went to see a lawyer just so I'd know what the rules were in this country. Well, it turned out of course that it's illegal to have those types of policies, but since nobody says anything, people are allowed to get away with it. So, I decided to file a complaint with the city. Now, of course, I wanted the owner of the club to face some consequences, since he's the one that made the policy and instructed his security to enforce it. But, that's not what happened. Sure, the owner had to answer a few questions and make sure that it would never happen again, but he made the poor security guy take the fall. Yeah, the doorman lost his job over it. I actually felt really bad, because the dude was just doing his job. BUT, the policy was changed. Did the real bad guy go down? No. But a change was made. He knew that next time it would be his ass on the line. That didn't happen here. The doorman didn't even go down, so the boss surely isn't thinking about changing policy.
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  12. Brutha Los
    Brutha Los says I'm glad to be able to inspire so much discussion around issues of race in the US. It seems like since 9/11 everyone has been in a haze of denial for far too long. First, Cody, thanks for you corrections. And I agree, it is a systemic issue. However, in my mind, that doesn't excuse the individuals who volunteer and, in fact, are paid to uphold that very system. Truth of the matter is that it's a system built on the property protection and suppression of economically exploited communities. In our cities, that translates as communities of color, across the pond, Asian and African. At the end of the day, these men, regardless of their race or reasoning, should be held fully accountable. Whatever the situation, they let off 50 shots. What sort of weaponry requires that kind of force to be deterred? Yes convictions, or at least full accountability of the individual cops is small compensation, but at this point, I'll take small compensation over none.
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  13. runobodyii
    runobodyii says TroyPowers, I really like your analogy. And, on the question of people just doing their jobs, the thing to remember is that Hitler, personally, killed no one. Just a lot of blokes stupidly doing their jobs. Thanks for the post, Brutha Los.
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  14. TroyPowers
    TroyPowers says Yeah, but you know what? I also feel a certain amount of sympathy for the SS soldier that didn't hate Jews, just hated watching his family starve.
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  15. Cody B
    Cody B says Brutha Los, now you are talking! "Truth of the matter is that it's a system built on the property protection and suppression of economically exploited communities." And remember everybody, I said, I believe excessive force was used! What I was saying is that I thought the cop had a right to fire. I am not an apologist for the police. What I also believe is that the institutions of our goverment and corporations need to be reigned in and part of that is holding higher ups responsible for actions of people in the field, along with the people who commit the actual crimes. Kinda the way RICO statutes work against organized crime. Another issue here is the Queens DA and their prosecution of this case. I don't know the details,but that needs to be explored, as well as the deep seeded problems with the police force.
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  16. Jonh Ingham
    Jonh Ingham says Los, about those 50 shots - in the heat of the situation I think the police get excited and just start pumping rounds. When I lived in Hollywood, one night we had a guy sitting outside the house who started pumping off a few rounds around midnight. We later learned that he'd lost his job and his girl had dumped him, so after a few drinks he'd walked up the hill, sat down on some steps and started shooting in the air to feel better. Well, it was a slow night and soon enough there were about 40 cop cars all over the place, doors open and cops with guns out as far as you could see. They're all shouting at the same time to put the gun down. The guy has now retreated into our carport behind our cars and decides to fire once at them. Instantly they all start shooting at once - literally hundreds of rounds. As far as I could tell there was no leader amongst the cops and there was certainly no order about firing - he shot at them, they just started shooting and didn't stop until they were either empty or tired. This whole episode repeated itself twice before the guy came out. He only had two minor wounds but the landlord's car had about 125 holes in it - insurance counted them all. Afterwards they were all talking amongst themselves and you could tell there was a whole macho thing going on. Which doesn't excuse anyone from shooting 50 rounds into someone, because they're meant to be professionals. There's something very wrong when they get off on it.
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  17. SerenityLife
    SerenityLife says http://mog.com/SerenityLife/blog_post/159097 My Main Blog Post on Sean Bell Case: http://peaurl.com/lUfI'>Thank you @Brutha Los and all the discussions here on the problem of NYPD here in NYC. Thank you too to @Troy Powers for directing me to the thread here in discussions of the case. I honestly did not look at this case as about race but more so about why a human had to be shot 40 plus times. That is inhumane to me. Did you know the killers (the police officers) were 2 black men and a white man? [picture in my main blog proves this] So, this is why race to me was not a huge factor but one of the problems to me is how the officers are trained and what they believe they should do when they think they see someone doing wrong. Further, I want to know what were the questions asked of the judge to decide the case? What law did he use to decide the case? Further, if you are aware of the Amadou Diallo case there is similar scenario but in his case an African immigrant was shot 40 plus times also and he had no weapon. He just had a wallet in his hand and the cops thought it was a gun. But, why would that prompt the police to shoot a defenseless man 40 times? As a resident of NYC and as someone who has witnessed the police interact with individuals in an abrasive way in some circumstances, I am honestly afraid of them because of how their judgment sometimes is misdirected. I had hope that a better verdict would come out. I honestly did but then you had a judge and not a jury making the decision so there is questions to me of the judge's mind frame of what he considered to be the evidence that he felt pointed to what were the real facts from the witnesses that presented before him. Tonight in Brooklyn there is a meeting about the Sean Bell case in Brooklyn and if anyone is in the area here is information on the meeting: http://peaurl.com/y5Y9 Further there have been protests but the mainstream media is not telling you all that is going on. Please check out the reports on ny1.com for they give you the news without a slant. Silent Protest in New York on the Sean Bell Case http://www.ny1.com/ny1/content/index.jsp?&aid=80923&search_result=1&stid=6 Thank you for sharing everyone. [I made a recent post on my MOG about it with a link to my main blog about the situation] Mog Blog --> http://mog.com/SerenityLife/blog_post/159097 My Main Blog Post on Sean Bell Case: http://peaurl.com/lUfI
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  18. Brutha Los
    Brutha Los says peace family- this is too great! thanks to all brave enough to help me explore my own thoughts on the subject. serenity, i fully agree. this is a human issue first. where this becomes a race issues has not to do with the fact that the cops involved are black, but the fact that these types of bar shootings by cops in NY and the rest of the country, seems to only take place in black neighborhoods and to black men in particular. there are a lot of bars in chelsea in NY, in georgetown in DC and in berkeley, CA that get rowdy regularly. they get as many police calls, and there are far more instances of reported sexually based abuses in these cases. however, the white boys at these bars don't get shot up. if the police, black or white, are trained to believe that black neighborhoods are war zones and that the mindset ought be one of defense and fear, the end game will continue to mean more dead black bodies at the hands of cops. and let's not forget, a couple of them dudes who beat rodney were brothers too. cody - yo, i never meant to suggest for a min that the cops were justified in shooting at all. i think what they did was vulgar at best and murderous at worst. they never should have pulled a weapon. however, if they did believe sean to be armed, they should have made that clear and responded appropriately. don't know if this was what i would call appropriate. for us to speak to power, power must be willing to listen. if not, i'm with serenity. hold the protest, if not in the streets, in our hearts and minds. mog in light- los
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  19. dachmo
    dachmo says I've paid close attention to this whole case. I come from a coptown where some of my family and a lot the guys I grew up with are now cops. What I'm going to say is just my personnel first hand knowledge, I'm not about to describe all cops. The guys I grew up with who went through the academy, the ones I know from MiddleSchool & HighSchool were all dunder heads, C students, they did coke when they could and got shit faced every weekend, smoking pot was too hippy for them. They tried to screw every girl that walked by and were for the most part narrow minded racists who talked about sports too much. When I was 14 my friends older brother who was a transit cop came home all coked up and drunk and decided to pull his service revolver on me and point it an inch away from my left eye all because I was beating his brother at some video game and wanted me to lose. My friend laughed, he laughed, I lost the game and subsequently lost the friend as well. The only good that came out of it is that now every time I get called for jury duty, I recount that story and I am almost immediately let go. Where am I going with this? The majority of guys who become cops do so because every male in their family is one or because they don't know what else to do with their lives. In NYC you need an associates degree to get on the force, which is basically two years at any community college. These guys are generally more interested in the fact that they get to retire after 20 years on the job with a full pension plan and medical. So if you you finish HS at 18, do your 2 years at a CC, spend another year in the academy you'll find yourself 21 years old and entering the PD, 20 years later at the age of 41 you're retired. The last year you work they take your last seven paychecks and come up with an average, that average becomes the weekly wage you receive for the rest of your life plus full medical for yourself and your family. It's a great deal because most guys start up a second career at this point and life becomes even better, if you live through the tough stuff. On that night those undercover inspectors where at the bar because of complaints received about working girls taking guys into the back and doing the nasty for money. These PO's were sent in to observe and see if such action was taking place. Sean Bell and his friends were there and were out in front of the place trying to leave when some guy got in Bells face about whatever, you can be sure it wasn't a convivial conversation because it brought one or two of the undercovers outside to see what was going on. At one point the verbal back and forth got so heated one of Bell's buddy shouted back something to the effect that he was "Going to his car to get a gun", the undercover heard this called his team out and pursued Bell and his friends down the street. Bell and his friends were probably now aware that they were being followed by guys that could have been friends of the dude they were just arguing with , so they hoped in their car and tried to get away when supposedly the cops yelled out that they were the police and to stop the car, but Bell and the guys in the car may not have heard this thinking that they were about to get ambushed by some thugs from the bar, so they're all freaked out and try to drive away. This led the cop to believe they were trying to run him over ( ie: endangering the life of a cop) so shots were fired as the car rolled to a stop one of the cops thought he saw someone in the car reach into the shadows inside the car and figured he was about to draw a gun, so the police opened fire. With the gunfire echoing off the buildings it sounded as if shots were coming back at them so they continued firing. Did Bells friend actually have a gun in the car? No. Was he trying to just save face and end a confrontation with some street thug? Yeah, probably. What should the cops have done? They heard the guy say he had a gun and he was going to come back for the guy, so of course the cops are going to follow them and try to stop him from retrieving that gun. This is where things went awry. Bells and his friends see three undercovers chasing them and they don't look like cops they look like guys they saw hanging out inside the club and they don't want to get into any altercation tonight they just want to get the fuck out of there. Cops are trained to see if sudden movements are made like if someone reaches under a seat or goes into the glove compartment because maybe he's looking for a weapon and since they were told he had one they were expecting it, so they opened fire when they saw what they thought was suspicious behavior inside the car. Should this have happened to Sean Bell and his friends, No way! Did the cops act accordingly? that's hard to say, why did the one guy shot 35 times?. Did the PO's do what they were trained to do? if they pulled out their badges and announced that they were cops which witnesses said they did (a few said they didn't). Then yes, the cops acted as they should have. Were Bell and his friends so freaked out and possibly drunk to understand what was happening, remember they were all worked up from the altercation in front of the club. Besides whenever I turn my car on my stereo starts playing however loud I last had it at, so maybe they didnt' hear anything at all! I think it was just a bad night in Jamaica Queens and unfortunately someone ended up dying. It sucks bigtime? If Bell was killed by a guy on the street they would be looking for his killer, but he was killed by a cop who had good reason to suspect they were armed and trying to make an escape by running him over.
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  20. SerenityLife
    SerenityLife says @brutha los - so true so true. My mother reminded me that the white cop shot Sean Bell 31 times. Ugh. So, I knew there was the race factor which we all do but there is also the life of a human being. These guns are destroying our world but it will never end. I feel as though we all risk our lives living in cities with high crime rates or even in middle America. Is it safe any where? Although I do live in New York City on the Upper West Side in a predominately white neighborhood, I purposely moved to that hood for safety but then it sometimes is hard on my sanity because some of my neighbors have said some really ignorant things to me over the years and now after 7 years we all tend to adore one another. But it took 7 years for some of my neighbors to warm up to me. They realized that I was not what they assumed and that I am actually pretty quiet and further I am educated so I even have had some ask me for legal advice. I was surprised there! @dachmo - thank you for clearing up so much for me. I always wondered why some people went into the police force and now I do see the trend of family members being a reason why. Further, I have met so many retired police officers in Florida who are living a good life because of their retirement. To me, some parts of Florida are mini clusters of the burroughs in New York. And, I appreciate you pointing out that the white cop shot Sean Bell over 30 times. My mother reminded me that today to let me understand there is a race factor and not to over look it but then too that justice is blind. I really appreciate you being so thorough in sharing. Much to digest and to understand but now I understand it more. Some Black families that I know do not talk to their children about those opportunities to have a job of stability of medical and retirement. However, I was raised that I could always get a government job to have the medical and retirement so that could have included the police force but I went to law school because my Mom is a lawyer. My mother went to law school because she was fed up with the injustices growing up in a segregated town in Florida where she could not use the same bathroom or water fountain as others. She felt that was unfair and that was a catalyst for going to law school. Further, my grandfather told my Mother that he would not become an American citizen unless my mother helped him out so she felt it was necessary to have her law degree too help him understand his rights (he was from Jamaica). Thank you for your thorough discussion! Much <3 and respect to everyone here in the discussion and at Mog! 2Serenity aka Jennifer
    Permalink posted 04/29/2008
  21. dachmo
    dachmo says Jennifer - I might not have made the point I wanted, cops these days don't take on the job because they want to help uphold the law and keep law abiding hard working people safe. It's a job, a job that gets them from A to B and generally NYC cops get paid almost nothing. That fact is another reason why the NYPD is not getting the cream of the crop. The coked up transit cop that put the gun to my head was a black man. Two of the guys I spoke of from HS were black men and a few others were Latino but yes the majority of the guys were white. Detective Isnora was the first to approach the car at which point he said he saw a gun and turned back yelling out to his fellow officers "Gun". Isnora was in fact the first officer to open fire on the car as his fellow detectives followed suit. Detective Michael Oliver, who is Turkish/Armenian, who during his 13 year career had over 600 arrests and had never before fired a single shot in the line of duty did the greatest damage with the bulk of his shots, in fact all the wounds received by Bell and his friends came from Olivers gun. Oliver said in trial that he kept thinking "I don't want to die" but he said the guys in the car kept acting like they had a gun, which he believed they had because Isnora had gotten up close and outright claimed to have seen one. from the NYTimes: "Detective Isnora followed Mr. Bell and his friends onto Liverpool Street, around the corner from the club, as Mr. Bell, Mr. Benefield and Mr. Guzman climbed into Mr. Bell’s gray Nissan Altima, the police said. A person briefed on Detective Isnora’s version of events said that the detective, his police badge around his neck, pulled out his gun, identified himself as a police officer and ordered the occupants to show their hands. They did not comply, the person said, but instead gunned the Nissan forward, hitting Detective Isnora and, seconds later, an unmarked green minivan carrying Detective Oliver and Officer Carey. It was Detective Isnora who fired the first shots, setting off the police fusillade." You also mentioned twice that the white issue is at case here when it comes to Michael Oliver. If your going to label a middle eastern man as white then would you also label Ricky Martin as a white? Is North Korean leader Kim Jong Il white as well? Furthermore, should a soldier who dropped a bomb on a house in Baghdad be responsible for the civilian deaths that occurred because he was given faulty information? I know the police are not at war with our communities but when guns and possible death come into play a sort of war mentality does develope. The problem is whether the police sussed out the situation properly and I believe what we have here is simply known as human error. I agree whole heartedly that there are some bad cops out there, I've met a few. We also both know that some atrocities have taken place between white cops and innocent black Americans. I don't believe what happened here happened because of these reasons.
    Permalink posted 04/30/2008
  22. Cody B
    Cody B says If they wanted to curb prostitution why didn't they just have a cruiser out there at closing time? Why the multiple undercover officers? Why wouldn't you expect there to be issues outside a strip club at closing time?
    Permalink posted 04/30/2008
  23. dachmo
    dachmo says there may have been more issues they needed to look into than just prostitution, When I worked with Joe's Pub cops undercovers were sent in all the time to see if underagers were being let in/served drinks, if drug deals were going on, if people are smoking and since we didn't have a cabaret license they were there to report on whether or not people were dancing. Cops don't just focus on "Black" clubs they do this at all clubs when a complaint is received.
    Permalink posted 04/30/2008
  24. Brutha Los
    Brutha Los says i guess i almost hear that d- it still leave a thinking mind to wonder why our white brothers and sisters, in the same types of environments across town don't ever end up full of bullets. until the consequence of the efforts that police make suddenly means that men of color dying at their hands is a rarity, then i gotta continue to believe that race plays the biggest factor in all of this. even within the context of this discussion, my original mog still stands. a lot of ways this country has to let black folks know we're not down, and it's just more institutionalized. no cops don't just focus on black clubs, cops only use black patrons as target practice.
    Permalink posted 04/30/2008
  25. Cody B
    Cody B says Brutha Los, when you said, "Things just don't change in the U.S.", you hit the nail on the head. On this particular incident, in terms of the facts, I think you can argue justification for firing, but the overall picture has not changed. We live in a country with so many deep seeded racial and class issues that poor folks and people of color suffer from, and it started at the beginning. The colonists came over, stuck their flag in the ground, and said, this is mine. It started out on a lie, and since then money has helped smooth over some things, but the fact remains. The United States (like most countries) is built on the back of free or cheap labor from which the huge portion of the benefit has gone to the land owning class. Until the institutionalized racism,classism, and sexism in this country are addressed some parts of this society will always be less than full citizens. Of course, Barack Obama and Rev. Wright offer a chance to enter into this discussion, but evidently the country isn't ready. It is easy to see how groups like the Black Panthers or someone like Malcolm X could get to the point where revolution is the only road. Violence and blunt force seem to be the only thing our Government understands. Fear is at an all time high, and along with out inherent institutionalized problems, is making this country into a sick place, where we are willing to trade human lives for "security." Like Gil Scott Said: From the Indians who welcomed the pilgrims And to the buffalo who once ruled the plains Like the vultures circling beneath the dark clouds Looking for the rain Looking for the rain Just like the cities staggered on the coastline Living in a nation that just can't stand much more Like the forest buried beneath the highway Never had a chance to grow Never had a chance to grow And now it's winter Winter in America Yes and all of the healers have been killed Or sent away, yeah But the people know, the people know It's winter Winter in America And ain't nobody fighting 'Cause nobody knows what to say Save your soul, Lord knows From Winter in America The Constitution A noble piece of paper With free society Struggled but it died in vain And now Democracy is ragtime on the corner Hoping for some rain Looks like it's hoping Hoping for some rain And I see the robins Perched in barren treetops Watching last-ditch racists marching across the floor But just like the peace sign that vanished in our dreams Never had a chance to grow Never had a chance to grow And now it's winter It's winter in America And all of the healers have been killed Or been betrayed Yeah, but the people know, people know It's winter, Lord knows It's winter in America And ain't nobody fighting Cause nobody knows what to save Save your souls From Winter in America And now it's winter Winter in America And all of the healers done been killed or sent away Yeah, and the people know, people know It's winter Winter in America And ain't nobody fighting Cause nobody knows what to save And ain't nobody fighting Cause nobody knows, nobody knows And ain't nobody fighting Cause nobody knows what to save
    Permalink posted 04/30/2008
  26. dachmo
    dachmo says I read recently that the gene that gives people blond hair and blue eyes is expected to be breed out of population within the next 200 years. Folks born today with red hair are getting fewer and fewer and the natural hue could be out of circulation 80 years from now. In the not too distant future, as the races mix and we finally become one, What do you think we'll hate each other for then? Money, religion, politics, what you got, what I don't got, Northerner, Southerner, Easterner, Westerner. Racism may go away but the misunderstanding that's at its base will always be.
    Permalink posted 04/30/2008
  27. Cody B
    Cody B says Money..
    Permalink posted 04/30/2008
  28. SerenityLife
    SerenityLife says @dachmo - did you know that I am mixed? So are you going to say when you see me that I am a black or that I am of mixed breed? You see my face here. I have white blood running through my veins too. It has been blood that was mixed 1) unwillingly through rape and 2) willingly through a love affair. Do I have to show you proof of this? My brown skin pretty much covers it or is it not enough. Even today a lighter black woman said something smart to me about my color and I am honestly wondering what is it that people are seeing and I do not? Am I that mysterious and un-identifiable even to my own people? Racism will never go away because we misinterpret, miscommunicate and are not rationale at times. I try to be civil and listen to all sides of a story because I am constantly misinterpreted too. Though I was unaware of the cop's ethnicity (Turkish/Armenian) visibly he looked white to me in the photos in the newspaper and on television as people say about me looking Indian/Ethiopian and from Pakistaini when I am African American. That was not an intentional mistake and I apologize if I offended you but I am trying to give you a glimpse of what I go through too. So thank you for clearing it up and letting me know the facts on him. So I understand the labels and misinterpreting. I apologize for not seeing the truth but despite that it is the fact that Sean Bell was shot 30 times. That is pretty excessive to me. I mean why 30 times ? Sean Bell was not on a firing range. This goes again to what I have been trying to tell people who live outside of New York City about the different ethnic groups and how we tend to misinterpret one another. Further, I am finding myself going deeper into solitude because of how I am treated by all ethnicities. How would you like someone to run up to you and ask - what are you? I honestly do not know why I go through so much in New York City. It is to the point that I think I need to wear a shirt explaining my mixtures. You know I get mistakened for East Indian? Ethiopian? I identify as African American despite having white blood (straight from England - my great grandfather was a white man from England), African blood, French blood, Jamaican blood, Native American blood and GOD who knows what else is in me? I do understand what you meant by the job situation, retirement, etc. Sorry if I went off a tangent here but I had to clear that up and I know Rick Ashley is from England. Though he has red hair I honestly do not know what his racial make up maybe. My own cousin who is my color has RED hair so that is why I am not too sure at times . So then maybe we need to stop saying black/white and go directly to cultural identification. But then we are going to mix up and not identify people correctly. I do not know what to say anymore on this cultural identification because I can never check all the boxes I want on a form asking my cultural identification. I chose to be identified as black American because that is America for you. Further, America won't even allow me to truly identify with my Native American ancestry although my great grandparents identified with the Cherokee Nation. I'm not mad just frustrated on this.. I am just human people! Thanks for allowing me to share.
    Permalink posted 05/01/2008
  29. dachmo
    dachmo says **Sean Bell trial: Just second to fire 31 shots - gun pro** By NICOLE BODE and CORKY SIEMASZKO DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITERS Tuesday, April 8th 2008, 1:37 AM In the time it takes to read this sentence, the three NYPD undercover cops accused of shooting Sean Bell could have fired most of the 50 rounds that killed him on his wedding day. A $250-an-hour private crime scene expert testified Monday that it would take just seconds to shoot that many bullets at Bell. "I fired 31 rounds as fast as I could," Alexander Jason said at the detectives' trial in Queens Supreme Court. "I was able to shoot 31 rounds in 12.3 seconds." That includes the time it took for Jason to reload - just as Detective Michael Oliver did on that tragic morning when he fired 31 shots at Bell with his 9-mm. Sig Sauer handgun. Jason said it took just 4.5 seconds to empty a 15-round magazine and the single bullet already in the chamber of his test gun. Also, the trigger on his Sig Sauer was stiffer than on the one Oliver used, he said. "Someone could shoot a gun faster with a lighter trigger," Jason said. for the full article go "here":http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny_crime/2008/04/07/2008-04-07_sean_bell_trial_just_second_to_fire_31_s.html I don't know how I got you on the tangent that concerns your ancestral identity. If it came from where I spoke about the future of human kind breeding becoming a melting pot where at some point all children will be born dark hair, dark eyes and olive skin, then you must understand I was not deriding mixed races. It's a process that has already started and over the course of the following centuries will turn our future civilization into one ethnicity. Which I believe is a good thing. Currently my makeup is German, French, Italian, English, Scots and Irish. I have always maintained that I was Irish being that the latest infusion of DNA into my families lineage is of Irish origin, my family name can also be traced back to an area of Northern Ireland. But if you do the math you'll find I'm equal parts English, German and Italian as well. So what does that make me, white would be the prevailing decision sure. I happened to be born in America seeing that I had no choice in the matter but do I see myself as American? No. I've never agreed with it's politics, I've never felt akin to it's society, I've always felt a man out of place. To sum up what I'm getting at: I am just a soul born into a genetic mish mash of a body in a land that was not of my choosing. My soul is not Irish, English, German, Italian, my soul is not affiliated to any political party. The chemicals that are in my body and brain does it's best to translate how my soul whats to live the life I was given and when I die my soul will leave without the processes of thought or of speech, it will not have connections to Ireland or England or any of the races that formed the body that become it's home for however long it gets to lived. You/We are NOT the sum of our parts. People hate indiscriminately, we see that on a daily basis. But as a lawyer, and I don't know what kind of Law you practice, you have to deal with the facts. I've stated in the comments above the facts of which I am assuming are the correct findings. I have to assume that the jury did their duty knowing that many people were going to be interested in what they had to say, if all the facts in the trial summed up to the three police officers being vindicated, as they were, then I'm going to have to believe the justifications for such a verdict were clearly evident and agree with the release of these three officers. Three officers with clean records, three officers who had been working the neighbourhood for many years. Michael Oliver had made 600 prior arrests in his career never once shooting his firearm in the process, why would he all of a sudden choose to become reckless and empty two clips into a man he's never had any dealings with unless something was going on that led him to believe that that was his only recourse. The sorrowful outcome was that an innocent man lost his life. The best thing that could come of this is that an alternative to bullets gets invented which allows the police to subdue the men in question without causing bodily harm. I also believe that some of my words may have been misinterpreted which led you to take offense with me and that was never my wish. The only question I have left is Who is Rick Ashley? and how did he and his red hair get in this conversation?
    Permalink posted 05/05/2008
  30. SerenityLife
    SerenityLife says @dachmo - apologize again for I thought this mention of Ricky Martin said Rick Ashley who really is Rick Astley. This is what you had said and I though you had said Rick Astley --> If your going to label a middle eastern man as white then would you also label Ricky Martin as a white? I misread. Apologize and I realize that I need to stop working these late hours. Rick Astley was a popular singer in the 1980s. A white man from England with bright red hair. The reason why I mentioned that is that again dealing with our genetic makeup it is interesting where my own cousin who is my color genetically has red hair. Further, Malcolm X even mentions in The Autobiography of Malcolm X on pg. 5 (this is the Grove Press, Inc. edition) Malcolm states, "It was, of course, because of him that I got my reddish-brown 'mariny" color of skin and my hair of the same color." So we can all have the genetic trait to have red hair. You never mentioned this and I am just making a point about genetics because some people are not aware of the variety of mixtures in the African Diaspora. Further, I honestly thought you had said Rick Astley and I know people always referred to his red hair so I had to share that people of the African Diaspora can have red hair too. Video of Rick Astley http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yu_moia-oVI For me the race issue was not as prevalent because of the 31 shots. That to me again is inhumane. Further, look at the racial makeup of the cops as you have pointed out here. Legally, there I have many questions which I choose not to share here because it will not be understood to a certain extent but it is dealing with civil procedure. I cannot explain a lot of that only because I would have to spend a lot of time explaining legal technicalities. This discussion is very hard to have without being sensitive to all the issues and to know that some of us are very sensitive to the issues at hand. Sharpton Announces Plans For Bell Verdict Protests http://www.ny1.com/ny1/content/index.jsp?stid=1&aid=81196 There is a lot of miscommunication going on between us and it is best for us to just let it rest now because you will not understand where I am coming from nor will I understand where you are coming from either. You will not understand me only because you have not lived in my shoes to experience how I see the world. I appreciate your sensitivity to the case and sharing with us.
    Permalink posted 05/05/2008

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